04w18:1 Matthew Barney Posted April 25th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 18 number 1 (Matthew Barney) Those of us on the list from Toronto will understand why this post is all about Matthew Barney and his Cremaster Cycle, since the AGO’s Jackman Hall has made the talk of the town all about the screenings, which began on Friday and continue next week. The decision to send out an issue on him was prompted by reading a review in yesterday’s National Post, which unfortunately is not included here because they have the article *for sale* on their website, which only makes me shake my head in disgust rather than reach for my wallet. Lucky for us, an even better review is available from Sarah Milroy at the Globe and Mail. There is another review, slightly irreverent in nature, that was written by yours truly two years ago for the Instant Coffee Saturday Edition, after seeing two of the films as part of that year’s Images Festival; and this marks the first time I’ve ever included some of my own thoughts in the Goodreads list. – Tim ——————————————————————— The art of the male mystique | Sarah Milroy http://tinyurl.com/yqna9 “When people look back at the work of the American artist Matthew Barney in 100 years time — and they will, Barney being one of the signal artists of our times — you have to wonder what they will make of it. His Cremaster Cycle is an epic series of five films, and it is nothing short of hallucinatory, a seven-hour-long immersion in one of the most dazzling imaginations any of us is likely to come up against any time soon. […] Barney places himself at the centre of this investigation; the films, made between 1994 and 2000, are self-portraiture on an epic scale…” Nurture boy | Katy Siegel http://www.findarticles.com/cf_0/m0268/10_37/55015167/print.jhtml “It’s mildly annoying that so many reviews and articles about Matthew Barney’s work begin in a confessional mode, with a ritual throwing up of hands. (Aren’t critics supposed to use their expertise to help us engage difficult work?) But it’s also understandable. The ‘Cremaster’ series layers biology and history, multiplies and divides; like any thick, opaque text, it drives the critic either to wax vaguely lyrical or to perform iconographic contortions, numerology, advanced exegesis. But beneath all these spectacular particulars (and with work like this, you always run the risk of the artist rolling his eyeballs at your ‘insights’), the art revolves around a fundamental conflict. Matthew Barney is better than you – and he’s sorry. His studio feels like a high school woodshop, and he dresses down, not in the worker drag of the artist flaunting his machismo, but rather in the T-shirt-and-jeans camouflage of the seriously above-average guy. Writers often note, with varying degrees of suspicion, his aw-shucks reluctance to claim the public sphere, to play the part of the great artist in either the sullen or the glamorous mold. Barney is elaborately nice, despite the fact that he is much better looking than you, much more successful, a much better artist with a much more interesting life (inner as well as outer, apparently). At the same time, he obviously has a riotous urge to excel, to succeed, to play and act in the world. The clash of these contrary, impulses – reticence and self-assertion – is central to his work.” Cremaster 1 & 4 | Timothy Comeau http://www.instantcoffee.org/saturday/issue7/index.html#tenten (scroll down a bit) “I feel that Barney’s films benefit from their exclusivity, by the fact that we’ve all read about them, but not all had the chance to see them. Like the dream sequence in the Big Liebowski, they would become trivial rather quickly if Barney exposed their ambiguous symbolism and made them available at Blockbuster. Movies with line-ups rule, cause at that point they’re an event. These two had quite a lineup, and participating in this must see aspect I found more enjoyable than the films, which were mediocre.” Article Date: May 2002 Master of ceremony | Daniel Birnbaum http://www.findarticles.com/cf_0/m0268/1_41/91202137/print.jhtml “BAYREUTH CAN WAIT: Matthew Barney’s CREMASTER cycle is a Wagnerian vision for the new millennium. It started, in CREMASTER 4, 1994, with a tap-dancing freak–half glitzy performer, half goat–dressed in white. With great care, the soft hands of three monstrous muses attached prosthetic gadgets to his elegant shoes–not since the early Andy Warhol has an artist spent so much energy on footwear. And it’s not only shoes in the traditional sense that play a central role in Barney’s work, it’s strange devices attached to the feet, tools for ritualistic practices and occult communication. In CREMASTER 3, 2002 (the recently debuted, last-to-be-realized installment of the pentalogy), a woman with crystal legs is suddenly transformed into a catlike creature, possibly in heat; a lovely lady with blades on her feet dices a roomful of potatoes, for reasons that will remain forever obscure; an elderly enchantress secretly lifts ceremonial instruments with her toes. Surely one way to enter Barney’s work is through the rich world of fetishism.” matthew barney versus donkey kong | Wayne Bremser http://tinyurl.com/ct7l “Despite the popularity of the Cremaster films, only a small percentage of museumgoers have ever seen an art film. After twenty-five years of cultural relevance, video games still do not have a serious place in museums and galleries. Cremaster 3 is important not only because it has attracted a wider audience to an art film, but also because it is one of the first works of contemporary art to incorporate video game narrative. […]Both Barney’s Entered Apprentice and Mario climb structures modified from what architects have intended. In the Chrysler Building Barney ascends the elevator shaft, which exposes the building’s innards. In the rivets degree of Donkey Kong, Mario must climb around an exposed, unfinished structure, walking over rivets to remove them. The perfect disorder of the titled girders in the ramps degree of Donkey Kong, transformed by an enormous jumping ape, match the perfect order of the ramps in Guggenheim rotunda, created by the most famous American architect. A climbing rig allows Barney to scale the rotunda, bypassing the ramps.” Matthew Barney Needs Slaves | Gawker.com http://www.gawker.com/topic/matthew_barney_needs_slaves_014357.php “Wanna work for 20 hours a week — for no payment whatsoever — for Matthew Barney, one of the top-grossing artists in the world? On the plus side, you might have some good Bjork sightings — on the minus side, she might beat you down like that Thai reporter.” —————————————- Long links made short by using TinyURL (http://www.tinyurl.com) To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@goodreads.ca http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com emailed by Timothy on Sunday 25 April 2004 @ 2:28 PM
04w16:1 Denis Young's 'About Painting' Special Edition Posted April 13th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 16 number 1 (Denis Young’s ‘About Painting’ Special Edition) I sent this out a couple of days ago, but anti-spam measure being what they are, I have reason to believe that some of you may not have gotten this one. So I’m sending it again to those who I feel may have been affected. If I am wrong in this, and you’ve gotten this twice, please let me know. – Timothy ——————————————————————— About Painting, The Old Paradigms: Are they still with us? | Denis Young http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com/denisyoung/aboutpainting.html “So: are the old paradigms still with us? Obviously, some survived, somewhat transformed, throughout the modern period and some did not […]Their history may be seen as that of the rewriting of earlier achievements in new terms — terms which, once established, modified the template taken for granted in the production of paintings, the template of what was ‘given’. […]Once the implications of this were understood some 50 years later, it became possible for philosophers like Arthur Danto to declare the history of art to be over, and all the old paradigms thus made available, if only through a rear-view mirror in a Looking-Glass world ruled by irony. […] But the paradigm changes that were once called ‘progress’ can equally be seen as the creation of an expanding universe of texts, all ‘nuanced reruns’ from the past (there really isn’t an alternative to that): a view that still leaves viable the old formula ‘instruction and delight,’ that does not limit the scope of painters to raise our consciousness of some issue, private or public, with enough freshness, subtlety or éclat to hold our attention; nor limit intellectual enterprise, or forthright, hedonistic works — though there, of course, the painter, skating around obstacles of taste, between high art and kitsch, will find thin ice.” —————————————- http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@goodreads.ca emailed by Timothy on Tuesday 13 April 2004 @ 7:47 PM
04w16:1 Denis Young's 'About Painting' Posted April 11th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 16 number 1 (Denis Young’s ‘About Painting’) ——————————————————————— About Painting, The Old Paradigms: Are they still with us? | Denis Young http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com/denisyoung/aboutpainting.html “So: are the old paradigms still with us? Obviously, some survived, somewhat transformed, throughout the modern period and some did not […]Their history may be seen as that of the rewriting of earlier achievements in new terms — terms which, once established, modified the template taken for granted in the production of paintings, the template of what was ‘given’. […]Once the implications of this were understood some 50 years later, it became possible for philosophers like Arthur Danto to declare the history of art to be over, and all the old paradigms thus made available, if only through a rear-view mirror in a Looking-Glass world ruled by irony. […] But the paradigm changes that were once called ‘progress’ can equally be seen as the creation of an expanding universe of texts, all ‘nuanced reruns’ from the past (there really isn’t an alternative to that): a view that still leaves viable the old formula ‘instruction and delight,’ that does not limit the scope of painters to raise our consciousness of some issue, private or public, with enough freshness, subtlety or éclat to hold our attention; nor limit intellectual enterprise, or forthright, hedonistic works — though there, of course, the painter, skating around obstacles of taste, between high art and kitsch, will find thin ice.” —————————————- http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@goodreads.ca emailed by Timothy on Sunday 11 April 2004 @ 11:50 PM
04w15:1 The East Coast with the Most Posted April 6th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 15 number 1 (the east coast with the most) ——————————————————————— Financial woes could close Atlantic arts mag | Phlis McGregor http://www.cbc.ca/arts/stories/artsatlmag20040405 “Atlantic Canada’s visual-arts community is watching anxiously, as a growing financial crisis surrounding Arts Atlantic magazine may jeopardize the future of the 27-year-old publication. […] The magazine, which relies on subscriptions, advertising and government grants to stay afloat, has suffered from a both a rising debt load and the elimination of some of its grants. The lack of revenue has forced the magazine to temporarily shut down production. These troubles are similar to those at many other Canadian magazines, said Gordon Laurin, chair of the magazine’s board. ” For $47.5-million, these Rooms should be full |Lisa Moore http://tinyurl.com/3gpu7 “Here’s the situation: We have a brand new $47.5-million facility in the heart of downtown St. John’s that would rival any arts centre in Canada. It is magnificently designed, offers gorgeous exhibition space, expert curatorial staff, state-of-the-art conservation laboratories and atmospherically controlled storage space. For more than a year, the staff of each of the three divisions of The Rooms have been working to create innovative arts and educational programming. They have been packing up the province’s substantial art collection, as well as museum artifacts and archival holdings for the big move to the new site. There was to be a gala opening this June. And now that everything is all packed up and ready to go, the opening of The Rooms has been cancelled for at least a year, as many as 30 staff members have been handed pink slips and more layoffs are scheduled for the near future.” —————————————- Long links made short by using TinyURL (http://www.tinyurl.com) To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@goodreads.ca http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com emailed by Timothy on Tuesday 06 April 2004 @ 10:37 PM
04w11:3 Photo vs. Painting Posted March 12th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 11 number 3 (photo vs. painting) ——————————————————————— The Richter Resolution | Jerry Saltz http://www.artnet.com/Magazine/features/jsaltz/saltz3-9-04.asp “In defense of the staggeringly radical act of really looking, the wildness of the imagination, and the limitlessness of pictorial invention, I propose a 48-month moratorium on the reproduction of photographs via overhead, opaque, or slide projectors in paintings (this means tracing too). Call this the Richter Resolution […] Like brushes and rulers, projectors are tools. This is about how these tools are used, which lately has become unadventurous.[…] By now, almost everyone would agree that the traditional Warhol-Richter-Walter Benjamin defense of the use of photography in painting, the Art in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction argument, and the chatter about ‘interrogating representation’ or ‘investigating the problem of the photograph,’ isn’t just dated, it’s shtick. We all know that photography is a remarkable and remarkably complex way of seeing and picturing the world; that the space between the photograph, the photographer and the thing photographed is incredibly rich; that the graphic field of the photograph is often scintillatingly alive, specific and very post-Renaissance; and that reproducing photographs in paintings once represented a significant repudiation of dearly held beliefs.” The camera today? You can’t trust it. | Jonathan Jones and Gerard Seenan http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/news/story/0,11711,1161737,00.html “David Hockney, the celebrated pop artist who has worked extensively in photography, has fallen out of love with the medium because of its digital manipulation and now believes it is a dying art form. […] ‘We can’t go back: Kodak got rid of 22,000 people when it ended its chemical developing. You’ve no need to believe a photograph made after a certain date because it won’t be made the way Cartier-Bresson made his. We know he didn’t crop them – he was the master of truthful photography. But you can’t have a photographer like that again because we know photographs can be made in different ways.’ […] The impact of computerised images was most strongly brought to his attention much closer to home: ‘My sister, who is just a bit older than me, she’s a retired district nurse, she’s just gone mad with the digital camera and computer – move anything about. She doesn’t worry about whether it’s authentic; she’s just making pictures.’ ” Disposable cameras | Jonathan Jones http://www.artdaily.com/news.asp?gid=393 “It adds fuel to his belief that painting can do things photography can´t, even when it comes to telling the truth about war. Everyone used to assume photographs of war were ‘true’ in a way photography can´t be. But Hockney argues that the digital age has made such a conception of photography obsolete. You can change any image now in any way you want. He once saw what a famous LA photographer´s portrait of Elton John looked like before it was retouched. The difference, he says, was ‘hilarious’. And now everyone can do this. […] If photography is no longer blunt fact, why not accept that painting has equal status? War photography is as fictional as painting, but painting can express profound insights denied photography. The famous photograph of a Russian soldier placing the red flag over Berlin is an example: ‘With the man putting the flag on top of the Reichstag – how did the photographer happen to get there first?’ wonders Hockney. By contrast, Goya´s image of the executions of May 3 1808 has a truth that transcends whether or not he was an eyewitness. Hockney thinks Picasso, when he painted his extremely anti-naturalist Massacres in Korea in the 1950s, was making this very argument against photography: instead of random glimpses of violence, Picasso´s painting presents his understanding of the war. ” —————————————- http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@instantcoffee.org emailed by Timothy on Friday 12 March 2004 @ 4:08 PM
04w11:2 Art Chairs Posted March 8th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 11 number 2 (art chairs) ——————————————————————— Good, better, best | Artblog.net http://artblog.net/index.php?name=2004-03-05-08-31-good “John Massengale (‘a recovering architect’) has an interesting post that talks about connoiseurship. Even though the topic is furniture as it relates to urban design, it has a few points that could be applied to art and art criticism. […] Most art schools teach how to invoke unprecedented reality, which is a better term for what this is usually called: originality. An artist ought to be generating at least some unprecedented reality or he’s not doing his job. But by emphasizing the novel, the art world has become fashion-driven. The cutting-edge art school experience has the students graduating with little more skill than they entered with, but with a finely-tuned art-world fashion sense. The blows to sincerity and integrity have been palpable. This is why I favor craftsmanship and connoiseurship – I believe human concerns ought to be addressed by art not just intellectually, but formally. Otherwise, you get the results that you often see on the gallery wall: art that does to your soul what sitting in the Mies chair does to your back. ” A Bag Is a Bag Is a Bag | Charlie Finch http://www.artnet.com/Magazine/features/finch/finch3-4-04.asp “Arties were lined up at the Elizabeth Dee Gallery on Saturday night to see the latest video from Alex Bag, whose droll, if increasingly formulaic, shape shifting was intercut with graphic, wallsize excerpts from the Paris Hilton sex tape. […] What makes this show worth seeing is not just the titillation, but the formal, esthetic dominance of the Paris Hilton sex video in a gallery context. […] Bag powerfully questions the whole fine-art enterprise, including her own efforts, that we art addicts experience today. On one wall, in one Chelsea cube, she argues that all the arch tributes to Kurt Cobain, all the Patty Chang-style contortions, all the Matthew Barney pinheaded grotesqueries are one raindrop compared to the cultural impact of a dick-hungry Hollywood heiress on the internet. ” A chance for amateurs to mumble ‘Huh?’ | Dave Barry http://tinyurl.com/yu4uh “Whenever I write about art, I get mail from the Serious Art Community informing me that I am a clueless idiot. So let me begin by stipulating that I am a clueless idiot. […] I saw ‘Chair’ at Art Basel, a big show on Miami Beach. It attracted thousands of Serious Art People, who wear mostly black outfits and can maintain serious expressions no matter what work of art they are viewing. This is hard, because a lot of Serious Art consists of bizarre or startlingly unattractive objects, or ‘performances’ wherein artists do something Conceptual, such as squirt Cheez Whiz into an orifice that has not been approved by the Food and Drug Administration for snack toppings. But no matter what the art is, a Serious Art Person will view it with the somber expression of a radiologist examining X-rays of a tumor. Whereas an amateur will eventually give himself away by laughing, or saying ‘Huh?’ or (this is the most embarrassing) asking an art-gallery person: ‘Is this wastebasket a piece of art? Or can I put my gum wrapper in it?’ ” http://goodreads.timothycomeau.com —————————————- Long urls made short by using TinyURL (http://www.tinyurl.com) To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@instantcoffee.org emailed by Timothy on Monday 08 March 2004 @ 9:28 PM
04w10:2 History Posted March 3rd, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 10 number 2 (history) ——————————————————————— The Reasons for the Current Upsurge in Memory | Pierre Nora http://www.iwm.at/t-22txt3.htm “It is of crucial importance, for it has shattered the unity of historical time, that fine, straightforward linearity which traditionally bound the present and the future to the past. In effect, it was the way in which a society, nation, group or family envisaged its future that traditionally determined what it needed to remember of the past to prepare that future; and this in turn gave meaning to the present, which was merely a link between the two. Broadly speaking, the future could be interpreted in one of three ways, which themselves determined the image people had of the past. It could be envisaged as a form of restoration of the past, a form of progress or a form of revolution. Today, we have discarded these three ways of interpreting the past, which made it possible to organize a ‘history’. We are utterly uncertain as to what form the future will take. And because of this uncertainty, the present-which, for this very reason no doubt, now has a battery of technical means at its disposal for preserving the past- puts us under an obligation to remember. We do not know what our descendants will need to know about ourselves in order to understand their own lives. And this inability to anticipate the future puts us under an obligation to stockpile, as it were, in a pious and somewhat indiscriminate fashion, any visible trace or material sign that might eventually testify to what we are or what we will have become. ” Artifact: Visionary Art | Charles Paul Freund http://www.reason.com/0402/artifact.shtml “These spectacles, auctioned in the fall by Sotheby’s, are said to have belonged to J.M.W. Turner (1775-1851), the British painter whose wholly original treatment of luminosity late in his career inspired the Impressionists and revolutionized art. But British eye surgeon James McGill, a student of Turner’s work, believes the glasses are evidence that Turner’s late style was actually a result of his deteriorating vision. Turner ‘was painting exactly what he saw,’ McGill told Britain’s Guardian. ” Artifact: Webcam in the Round | Charles Paul Freund http://www.reason.com/0401/artifact.shtml “Behold the Tholos, where the webcam meets the circular, painted panorama of the 19th century. The device, which features a 23-foot wrap-around screen some 10 feet high, works in pairs: People gathered at one Tholos can see real-time, life-size HDTV images of people around a distant partner device, with microphones enabling users to converse.” —————————————- http://www.instantcoffee.org/tim/goodreads To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@instantcoffee.org emailed by Timothy on Wednesday 03 March 2004 @ 2:09 PM
04w07:1 Private Parts Posted February 9th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 7 number 1 (private parts) ——————————————————————— Privacy and Deviance | HP Laboratories http://www.hpl.hp.com/research/idl/papers/deviance/index.html “Privacy is a central issue of concern in the information age. Because of the ease with which data about individuals can be obtained, aggregated and dispersed, information technology can broadcast an individual’s secrets to unintended recipients who in turn can use it in ways that the individual no longer controls […] Our conjecture and motivation is that people are willing to reveal information whenever they feel that they are somewhat typical or positively atypical compared to the social group […] In order to test this hypothesis, we conducted experiments that revealed the true value that people place on their private data. Specifically, we tested whether deviation from the mean is the dominant factor in dictating how a person values a piece of information. We find with great significance (in excess of 95% statistical confidence) that the further a private piece of information deviates negatively from the mean, the greater the price demanded for that information. Furthermore, we find that small deviations in a socially positive direction are associated with a lower demanded price.” Experiment: To Become a Photographer of Female Nudes | Grant Stoddard http://www.nerve.com/regulars/ididitforscience/nudephotography/index.asp?page=1 ” ‘Look, if you ask nicely, it’s amazing what people will do. Be up front, confident and respectful and see what happens. ‘ ‘But you have a ready-made harem!’ ‘But you have an accent,’ he reasoned. ‘ You’re miles ahead of the game.'” —————————————- http://www.instantcoffee.org/tim/goodreads To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@instantcoffee.org emailed by Timothy on Monday 09 February 2004 @ 4:06 PM
04w04:4 Computer Security vs. Robertsons Posted January 30th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 4 number 4 (computer security vs. robertsons) ——————————————————————— All screwed up and nowhere to show | Brad Wheeler http://tinyurl.com/ys2bq “The package was delivered to London’s Rebecca Hossack Gallery well in advance of the fair’s gala opening on Wednesday evening. Just one problem, though: The screws used to fasten the crate were Robertson square drives — a circular screw with a recessed square made to receive a matching hand driver. Quite common in Canada, the make is all but unheard of across the pond”. A Visit from the FBI | Scott Granneman http://www.securityfocus.com/cgi-bin/sfonline/columnists-item.pl?id=215 “Dave also had a great quotation for us: ‘If you’re a bad guy and you want to frustrate law enforcement, use a Mac.’ Basically, police and government agencies know what to do with seized Windows machines. They can recover whatever information they want, with tools that they’ve used countless times. The same holds true, but to a lesser degree, for Unix-based machines. But Macs evidently stymie most law enforcement personnel. They just don’t know how to recover data on them. So what do they do? By and large, law enforcement personnel in American end up sending impounded Macs needing data recovery to the acknowledged North American Mac experts: the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. Evidently the Mounties have built up a knowledge and technique for Mac forensics that is second to none.” Long urls made short using TinyUrl (www.tinyurl.com) —————————————- http://www.instantcoffee.org/tim/goodreads To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@instantcoffee.org emailed by Timothy on Friday 30 January 2004 @ 4:39 PM
04w04:2 Latin vs. Dizzee Rascal Posted January 27th, 2004 by timothy. Good Reads Mailing List | 2004 week 4 number 2 (Latin vs. Dizzee Rascal) ——————————————————————— The utterly new sounds of Dizzee Rascal, Britain’s rising superstar. | Sasha Frere-Jones http://slate.msn.com/id/2094205/ “As a sensory experience, Boy in da Corner is a bit like being trapped in an MRI chamber while somebody yells at you; it is hammering, anxious music. ‘Grime,’ the term record stores and critics have agreed on, feels like the right word. While American hip-hop songs sometimes show up as instrumentals in live grime sets, grime moves nothing like American music. The tempos are faster than hip-hop’s. Jay-Z, for example, favors the 100 beats per minute range. Grime lives around 130 BPM, a zone of urgency and movement. 50 Cent sounds like Simon and Garfunkel next to Dizzee Rascal.” Roman rebound | The Economist http://www.economist.com/printedition/displayStory.cfm?Story_ID=2281926 “Small wonder then, that some people still prefer their news in Latin, and that the centre of Latin news broadcasting nowadays should be Finland, a country of translucent birches, lakes and blondes, and with a language the opposite of universal. The Finnish Broadcasting Company (aka Radiophonia Finnica Generalis, or YLE) puts out a five-minute bulletin, Nuntii Latini, every week, and has done so for 14 years. The bulletins are broadcast worldwide, and are also collected and published as books. The conjunction of Latin with Finno-Ungaric makes for some bizarre listening and reading, as in ‘Anneli Jäätteenmäki, quae munere ministri primarii a mense Aprili functa est, a praesidente Tarja Halonen dimissionem petivit et accepit.’ But people in more than 50 countries, from East Timor to Uruguay, are tuning in, sending Latin letters of appreciation and begging for ancient Greek.” video is Latin for “I see” —————————————- http://www.instantcoffee.org/tim/goodreads To remove or add yourself from this list, email tim@instantcoffee.org emailed by Timothy on Tuesday 27 January 2004 @ 3:32 PM
